Evil

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Evil

Post by Pound Cake on Tue Dec 01, 2015 7:03 pm

Is evil lack of goodness, or does it have an existence of its own?
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Re: Evil

Post by Jehoshaphat on Tue Dec 01, 2015 7:34 pm

Evil is the lack of goodness.
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Re: Evil

Post by Pound Cake on Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:45 pm

What makes you say that?
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Re: Evil

Post by War Doctor on Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:47 pm

Because if evil had an existence of its own then God would have created evil and He doesn't create evil.
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Re: Evil

Post by Jehoshaphat on Tue Dec 01, 2015 9:43 pm

Because evil would be opposite of God. Why would God create something the opposite of himself? God doesn't contradict himself.
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Re: Evil

Post by Blitz on Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:39 pm

Well then if evil is the lack of goodness, why does Jesus call humans evil multiple times?
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Re: Evil

Post by War Doctor on Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:01 pm

Because at times we are lacking in goodness but that is the point of the Christian life to be filled with God so there is nothing beside Him.
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Re: Evil

Post by Blitz on Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:23 pm

Then you agree with me that all men are evil outside of Christians?
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Re: Evil

Post by War Doctor on Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:34 pm

No, I would say that we as humans still have an inherently good nature since we were created by God in His image but that since we live in a fallen world we will listen to the absence of God instead of God.

Now I think we've always had a misunderstanding about inherently good and being good. Inherently good just means we are made in the image of God and have a natural yearning for him. Being good is a completely different thing all together, I can yearn for God but fill that yearning with bad things. 

But what I've gotten from you before is that outside of being a Christian one can't do anything good. So if an atheist serves in a soup kitchen they are not doing good, would that be an accurate description of your view?
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Re: Evil

Post by Blitz on Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:13 pm

But that is like saying because a pear was at one point good and delicious, it can't become spoiled and rotten to the core. 

The Bible says that "None seek God, They are all gone out of the way, etc." 

I would say that is a good thing in the worlds mind.
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Re: Evil

Post by War Doctor on Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:19 pm

We're not pears though, we're human beings made in God's image. Are you saying that sin and evil are so powerful that they can erase God's goodness from us? 

A Psalms talking about fools said that. But look at the Ethiopian in Acts, he was clearly looking for God on his own. There are countless examples of people searching for God throughout the Bible and history. 

Okay but not in a real way?
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Re: Evil

Post by Blitz on Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:25 pm

What if we allow sin to erase good from us utterly? Have you ever read about serial killers who are so despicable? 

That is a quote from Romans. God seeks us out, not the other way around. Look at Noah's day. 

Yes, like sin is equal in God's eyes and not ours.
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Re: Evil

Post by War Doctor on Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:28 pm

I just don't think we or evil are more powerful than God, even serial killers. 

Well I disagree about us not seeking God out but this goes to predestination vs free will though and is another debate.
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Re: Evil

Post by Blitz on Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:37 pm

True but God gave us the will to chose our path.
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Re: Evil

Post by Isaiah the Ox on Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:13 pm

Just wondering, is the Definition of Evil a common debate in Catholic/EO churches? Because I had never heard of it before I met WD. 0_o
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Re: Evil

Post by War Doctor on Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:22 pm

Not in my experience, I think it's pretty agreed upon that God didn't create evil.
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Re: Evil

Post by Blitz on Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:33 pm

I'm reading a book that has Christian over tones, and it gives a really good explanation of evil. Its rather long and runs through the books though.
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Re: Evil

Post by Pound Cake on Mon Dec 07, 2015 6:48 pm

War Doctor wrote:Because if evil had an existence of its own then God would have created evil and He doesn't create evil.
Not necessarily. God is the only one who can create from nothing,but the devil twists everything. I guess it depends on our definition of create. Maybe the devil didn't create evil from nothing (only God can do that, presumably.) But he could have created it in the sense when you combine hydrogen and oxygen you get water. In which case, evil is an entity existing unto itself.
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Re: Evil

Post by War Doctor on Mon Dec 07, 2015 7:01 pm

But water doesn't exist apart from hydrogen and oxygen, in the same way whatever is twisted to be evil couldn't exist without that base; which is good.
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Re: Evil

Post by Pound Cake on Mon Dec 07, 2015 7:30 pm

Correct. The point remains, even if it couldn't exist without its base, it could exist due to it. In other words, while it probably couldn't exist in the way good exists, that is, as something made from nothing, it could exist as water exists, something made from something.
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Re: Evil

Post by Jehoshaphat on Mon Dec 07, 2015 7:42 pm

I would disagree because unlike water, evil isn't a physical things. Your comparing apples to oranges.
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Re: Evil

Post by Pound Cake on Mon Dec 07, 2015 8:42 pm

Yes, but do you see the principle? Something can exist do to being created by supernatural means (coming from nothing) or it can exist due to being formed from something preexisting (coming from something.)
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How Is God Not the Cause of Evil When He Could Stop It?

Post by Pound Cake on Sat Dec 12, 2015 9:36 pm

If you walk by a murder, and do not try to stop it in any way, you are to some degree the cause of it. How is God not the Cause of evil when He could stop it with no effort?

Note, this is not a question of why there is evil in the world. The question again is this. Assuming there is evil and that is necessary for God's plan, how is God not causing evil?
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Re: Evil

Post by Countess on Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:34 am

Pound Cake wrote:If you walk by a murder, and do not try to stop it in any way, you are to some degree the cause of it. How is God not the Cause of evil when He could stop it with no effort?
Am I the cause of wars when I don't go and stop them? How is other people fighting and doing evil things and I not intervening making me the cause. I think you are using the wrong word. The cause is what makes it happen...the root of the problem, that's the cause. If someone doesn't intervene to stop a murder, they didn't cause the murder to take place, they only failed to stop it. #Clarification 

So realize Satan is the root and cause behind all sin and evil.
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Re: Evil

Post by Pound Cake on Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:10 pm

If you do not help someone, and you could and, as in this situation, have a moral obligation to, then yes you are responsible for it. You are not, as you say, "the root cause." You are not the main cause. You are, however, an indirect cause. You could have made some effort to stop the murder and didn't. You didn't even shout for help, nothing. So yes, it would be on you to some degree.


Last edited by Pound Cake on Wed Dec 16, 2015 6:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Evil

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