The Great Schism

Page 2 of 2 Previous  1, 2

View previous topic View next topic Go down

The Great Schism

Post by Mr. S on Wed Jan 06, 2016 2:10 pm

First topic message reminder :

I write this because I am very curious about discussions with my Catholic and Orthodox friends. Both groups (Catholics and Orthodox) tell me that they are the true Church (with a capital "C"). To not join them is to put myself in the unenviable position of being outside the true Church. Yet, I want to ask: who is right, who truly has the authority? There was a great division: the Great Schism, which separated Catholics and Orthodox (West and East). How did that divide authority? Is it that one side retained all authority and the other side lost it unequivocally? Was there a 50/50 split? Does one side have the greater authority, but not the whole authority it once had? I wanted my Catholic and Orthodox friends to inform me of their perspective on this matter--hence this post.
avatar
Mr. S
Apprentice

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 10
Male

Back to top Go down


Re: The Great Schism

Post by Jehoshaphat on Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:31 pm

Say I chose to serve God by going out and murdering anyone I want, would I be free to do that?
avatar
Jehoshaphat
Apprentice

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 91
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by Luther on Mon Apr 18, 2016 11:30 pm

Was Luther against indulgences? 
He was very cautious about accepting them. However, I would go farther and say they are ridiculous and mock God. 

Do you think infant baptism can be practiced without the motivation of control? 
It can be, yes. However, only those who do not wish free will for their child would inflict this. 

Can one choose any way to serve God?
Define "any way."

Say I chose to serve God by going out and murdering anyone I want, would I be free to do that?
I'm not sure how this is relevant to any of this conversation?
avatar
Luther
Apprentice

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 40
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by War Doctor on Mon Apr 18, 2016 11:48 pm

So why do you admire a man who believed in something you think mocked God? 

So I don't wish free will for my children? 

I mean what are the limits on what I as an individual can decide is serving God?
avatar
War Doctor
Administrator

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 217
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by Jehoshaphat on Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:24 am

It is completely relevant because I am presenting a way to follow God. Maybe it would be the wrong way for you but it could be the right way for me. What would stop me from starting to murder people in order for me to honor God in the way I see fit?
avatar
Jehoshaphat
Apprentice

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 91
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by Luther on Tue Apr 19, 2016 4:24 pm

So why do you admire a man who believed in something you think mocked God? 
Have you ever admired someone who you didn't agree with his every stance?

So I don't wish free will for my children? 
That depends. Are you baptizing them?

I mean what are the limits on what I as an individual can decide is serving God?
Trying to determine what the "limits" are and how far one can "go" is a completely wrong approach to solving this. Jesus said He is the only way to God. That is a pretty basic answer.

It is completely relevant because I am presenting a way to follow God. Maybe it would be the wrong way for you but it could be the right way for me. What would stop me from starting to murder people in order for me to honor God in the way I see fit?
Seems to me then, that many groups have done that, including the Catholics. And no, not honoring God the way "we" see fit, but rather the way He sees fit. Completely wrong attitude.
avatar
Luther
Apprentice

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 40
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by War Doctor on Tue Apr 19, 2016 5:13 pm

You make a good point, I do admire people that I don't agree with completely

I will baptize my children 

Okay but Jesus is the only way to God is a pretty incomplete answer. What if I say Jesus wasn't fully God? You say it's a pretty basic answer but I'm pretty sure you have more complex thoughts on how that works out in real life.
avatar
War Doctor
Administrator

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 217
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by Jehoshaphat on Tue Apr 19, 2016 7:54 pm

How can we know what He sees fit, wouldn't that be completely a matter of personal interpretation according to your view?
avatar
Jehoshaphat
Apprentice

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 91
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by Luther on Thu Apr 21, 2016 3:29 pm

Okay but Jesus is the only way to God is a pretty incomplete answer. What if I say Jesus wasn't fully God? You say it's a pretty basic answer but I'm pretty sure you have more complex thoughts on how that works out in real life.
If Jesus is the only way to God, then knowing what He says is a undoubtedly clear way to begin the process of knowing God. 

How can we know what He sees fit, wouldn't that be completely a matter of personal interpretation according to your view?
Are you of the opinion that God cannot help an individual find Him and must go through several layers of church authorities?
avatar
Luther
Apprentice

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 40
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by War Doctor on Thu Apr 21, 2016 4:20 pm

Yeah that is a very clear starting point but it seems like it'd get pretty complicated after that. I mean even that statement "If Jesus is the only way to God" is pretty complex. I mean who is Jesus? Man? God? Both? Do I get to make that call by myself? "the only way" what if that's not the case? What if there are other ways, I mean even in Acts we see people putting forth other ways besides Jesus. Then finally "God" that's pretty deep, is this the God of the Old Testament? If so how do you know that? 

Do I as an individual have to, or even should I, figure out the answers to those questions in a vacuum?
avatar
War Doctor
Administrator

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 217
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by Jehoshaphat on Thu Apr 21, 2016 4:32 pm

I believe that the way God shows the way is through the Church he established, not simply our own interpretation.
avatar
Jehoshaphat
Apprentice

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 91
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by Luther on Tue Apr 26, 2016 8:10 pm

I mean who is Jesus? Man? God? Both?
Take all the scriptures that discuss this topic, and you have your answer. 

It seems to me you are making this unnecessarily complicated. 

Do I as an individual have to, or even should I, figure out the answers to those questions in a vacuum?

So let me get this straight, you believe scripture is a vacuum?
avatar
Luther
Apprentice

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 40
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by War Doctor on Tue Apr 26, 2016 8:36 pm

No, Scripture is not a vacuum, first of all because we wouldn't have Scripture without authoritative dogma. I mean how did the Bible come about? But saying we need to take Scripture by itself by just "taking all the scripture that discuss this topic, and you have your answer" is ignoring the context of Scripture. That it was written by, to, and given in the context of the Church. Without that context we see what happens in Protestantism, tens of thousands of denominations all disagreeing. 

You say I'm making this unnecessarily complicated, I think I'm actually the one arguing for simplicity. One Church not ten thousand denominations.
avatar
War Doctor
Administrator

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 217
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by Isaiah the Ox on Sun Jun 05, 2016 2:06 pm

So, why did the West keep the name "Catholic" and the East the name "Orthodox"?
avatar
Isaiah the Ox
Administrator

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 98
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by War Doctor on Sun Jun 05, 2016 3:58 pm

I really have no idea
avatar
War Doctor
Administrator

Status :
Online
Offline

Posts : 217
Male

Back to top Go down

Re: The Great Schism

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 2 of 2 Previous  1, 2

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum